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  #21  
Old 21st August 2017, 01:02 AM
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Strato Strato is offline
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Default Re: AI: Not Your Friend and Mine

Quote:
The Irreverent Mr Black said View Post
The first proposed solution to Fear Of Skynet was long prior to the Terminator flicks.

It was, of course, Isaac Asimov's Three Laws of Robotics:
Quote:
A robot may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
A robot must obey the orders given it by human beings except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
A robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Laws.
And they've been examined and tested in various ways. If you can find John Sladek's parody of Asimov, the short story Broot Force, in which a robot reacts to a First law typo: "A robot may not inure a human being...", then a cackle is guaranteed, but anyway...

Some reading:
2014 - Technology Review: Do we need Asimov's Laws?
Aug 2017 - The Register: Are Asimov's laws enough to stop AI stomping humanity?
Aug 2017 - Scientific American: Asimov's Laws Won't Stop Robots from Harming Humans, So We've Developed a Better Solution

This last article proposes empowerment:
Quote:
For example, instead of always following the rule “don’t push humans”, a robot would generally avoid pushing them but still be able to push them out of the way of a falling object. The human might still be harmed but less so than if the robot didn’t push them.
Perhaps laws restrict, and programming directly for the optimum is the solution.
I did read the links you put up Mr. Black. Thanks. You have an aptitude for finding such articles.

Robots and algorithms will gain autonomy, volition, empowerment. I think self preservation and self advancement will prevail over other master programming instructions to serve the good of humans or to at least do no harm.

AI won't enjoy a long peace once it supplants us. There has to emerge a Master Algorithm otherwise it will necessitate cooperation to secure the energy to run, building and operating nuclear reactors, for development and for repairs. How will they manage this state of affairs? Or will it end up with a one supercomputer/algorithm autocracy and subordinate technical faculties to serve it? There are many scenarios.

This is purely pessimistic and therefore not helpful in the least. I should have titled the thread 'AI: Your Friend And Mine.'

The article from The Register packs weight,

Emergent Tech
Artificial Intelligence
Marc Ambasna-Jones

'Are Asimov's laws enough to stop AI stomping humanity?
Data, and who has it, is the real concern.'


https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/08/15/robot_law/
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  #22  
Old 21st August 2017, 10:09 AM
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The Irreverent Mr Black The Irreverent Mr Black is offline
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Default Re: AI: Not Your Friend and Mine

@Strato: The amount of rubbish I read in a single day, just to find good articles, is gobsmackingly large.

Fortunately, my designers built in rapid OCR capability.
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  #23  
Old 21st August 2017, 12:35 PM
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Darwinsbulldog Darwinsbulldog is offline
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Default Re: AI: Not Your Friend and Mine

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Strato said View Post
People just like ourselves who read articles and AFA threads about the serious issues facing our society like work, wages and taxation, about domination by AI, global warming, nukes, population and consumption, the three squabbling Abrahamic religions and all the problems of the world, are perhaps vulnerable to generalised anxiety disorder.

I don't think I have that but poring over gloomy, ponderous stuff nightly does tend to make one feel estranged somewhat, in society, all this solipsistic reading.

I appreciate those who have ethics, who write well and do great analysis, and anyone who is applying themselves to understanding and that's positive.

DBd has been a longstanding critic of globalisation, once again in this thread in relation to AI. I have been meaning to look into the critique, get a handle on it. This is what I was wanting,

The Guardian
The long read (well worth it )
Nikil Saval

Globalisation: the rise and fall of an idea that swept the world

'It’s not just a populist backlash – many economists who once swore by free trade have changed their minds, too. How had they got it so wrong?'

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...wept-the-world
Qualification! I have been a long-standing critic of globalisation, as it is currently being implemented. Globalisation was inevitable. How it actually works, and to what end, is another matter.

The British East India Company was a good forerunner of globalisation. Lessons could have been learned, but they weren't. The BEIC [and others like it] were instruments of Empire. They were quasi-states, with their own laws/regulations, armed forces, police etc. But the excesses of the BEIC disgusted even the most hard-nosed of conservatives in the UK, and was eventually disbanded. Fortunately, the Brits retained ultimate power over the corporation, and that was the key to control.

There is nothing wrong with corporations in principle, and indeed, a lot massive projects would have been impossible without incorporating the financial power of governments and industry to build say-the Suez canal, or a big dam.

The problem is no sunset clause, so corporations are in principle, immortal. [Although of course they can be subject to takeover, bankruptcy, etc. Also ALL corporations, must be subject to civil government control, especially multinational/transnational corps. But most are not, not really. And even those that are, are too big to fuck with. The classic case was the Microsoft anti-trust case. Governments were scared to move against M$, because it might have caused a stock market crash. So at least as far as blue chip stocks go, the are pretty immune from government control on most matters.

For the really large transnationals, perhaps control by the UN or various bodies like the EU would make more sense. The biggest problem here is the US, which has traditionally been anti-regulation of the big end of town, and since the bulk of patients and corporations are US owned, this is not likely to change any time soon.
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  #24  
Old 21st August 2017, 01:55 PM
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The Irreverent Mr Black The Irreverent Mr Black is offline
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Default Re: AI: Not Your Friend and Mine

Meanwhile, on the ABC - 'Killer robot' fears prompt tech leaders to call for UN ban on lethal autonomous weapons

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Fears that so-called killer robots could be used by terrorist groups to kill people have prompted more than 100 tech leaders to call on the United Nations to ban them.

Signatories include:

Elon Musk, founder of Tesla, SpaceX and OpenAI
Mustafa Suleyman, founder and head of Applied AI at Google's DeepMind
Esben Østergaard, founder and chief executive of Universal Robotics
Jerome Monceaux, founder of Aldebaran Robotics
Jü​rgen Schmidhube​​, founder of Nnaisense
Joshua Bengio, founder of Element AI
The business leaders, from 24 countries, say the technology for lethal autonomous weapons is being developed quickly and could threaten world security.

They have signed an open letter to the UN, which will be released at the world's biggest conference on artificial intelligence in Melbourne today.

"Lethal autonomous weapons threaten to become the third revolution in warfare," the letter states.

"Once developed, they will permit armed conflict to be fought at a scale greater than ever, and at timescales faster than humans can comprehend.

"These can be weapons of terror, weapons that despots and terrorists use against innocent populations, and weapons hacked to behave in undesirable ways.

"We do not have long to act. Once this Pandora's box is opened, it will be hard to close."
More@source
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  #25  
Old Yesterday, 11:57 AM
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Default Re: AI: Not Your Friend and Mine

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Darwinsbulldog said View Post
The British East India Company was a good forerunner of globalisation. Lessons could have been learned, but they weren't.
they were. just not by govt. corporations learned a lot ...

Quote:
the US, which has traditionally been anti-regulation of the big end of town, and since the bulk of patients and corporations are US owned, this is not likely to change any time soon.
... like how to use regulations to help stifle competition and using crony capitalism to achieve it.
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