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  #51  
Old 6th September 2017, 02:31 PM
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Default Re: Christianity is dying.

quite a few things here

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Goldenmane said View Post
It's not just the thrashing, spasming beast of Christianity, but of authoritarianism in general. The rise of the new fascism goes fist-in-glove with absurdities such as Brexit. The New Nazis in the US are very often avowedly non-theistic, but Trump's their poster boy as much as he is the Evangelicals'.
well ... this is an expanded scope. the rise of authoritarianism is undeniable. I do think it is tied to religiosity, not so much from any specific doctrine point of view but more the ease with which people believe shit without questioning, the imbecile view of 'good vs. evil' without any shades of 'in between', the craving for easy, magical solutions, the desire for a 'power beyond me' to intervene and fix things, the 'us vs. them' false dichotomy, etc.

I am not sure the neo nazis are 'avowedly non-theistic'. granted, it is not front and center for them, but from what I have seen and read, most - if asked - would state they are xtians and even try to justify what they are doing as biblical in origin.

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My own feeling, from the abysmally little I know of anything, is that there is always this cross-section of fucking frothing shitbergs floating along in society, and they surge and ebb with the tides of history, to mangle a metaphor.


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Most people don't have the energy to sustain the single-minded pursuit of abject fucknuttery required to form a political movement of any kind, let alone one dedicated to the destruction and subjugation of vast swathes of society. In every political movement, there are those driving the clown-car. Those single-minded and dedicated enough to power collective shifts. That takes some serious fucking fortitude and weirdness. Fuck, look at us. Every goddamn one of us who has been doing this shit for any length of time is to one degree or another exceptional, and many of us are plumb mad. There's a reason a colloquial definition of madness is 'doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result'.
totally agree. but every leader needs followers. and at least as far as religion in the western world is concerned, there are less and less followers. but as I argued above, being religious is more than just following a specific doctrine. so the same malaise persists and instead of religion we get various other (mostly political) dogmas, ascribed to by just as much zealotry.

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Just think on that for a moment, and ponder this: how fucking unhinged do you have to be to spend decades successfully building the political strength of the Dominionist movement?
from what I can tell, not that much. some truly believe and while we may find them unhinged, to them it is natural. though I suspect that in the US, many use it as a smoke screen and are really - borrowing from Zappa - only in it for the money.

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And these shifts are, I'm pretty sure, driven by powerful minorities. I'd bet you pennies to dildoes that any fascist-type power-grab that has ever succeeded wasn't actually done with the full knowledge and consent of the majority of the populace.
full knowledge? no. consent? I think yes, at least initially and certainly obtained due to lack of full knowledge.
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  #52  
Old 7th September 2017, 06:46 AM
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Default Re: Christianity is dying.

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We see it with Trump. He lost the popular vote, but won based on the system which had been gerrymandered and gamed for fucking decades and because a bunch of people who should have voted couldn't be arsed.
there may be hope

Prominent Republicans Urge Supreme Court to End Gerrymandering



https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/06/u...mandering.html


Quote:
Breaking ranks with many of their fellow Republicans, a group of prominent politicians filed briefs on Tuesday urging the Supreme Court to rule that extreme political gerrymandering the drawing of voting districts to give lopsided advantages to the party in power violates the Constitution.
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  #53  
Old 7th September 2017, 07:56 AM
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Default Re: Christianity is dying.

back on topic ...

The Non-Religious States of America



https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...s-prri/538821/


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There was a time, not too long ago, when the vast majority of Americans identified as Christians, at least nominally. In some places, this dynamic hasn’t changed much: Head south, for example, and you’ll find that roughly 60 percent of Mississippians are Baptists. But in at least 20 states, religiously unaffiliated people make up a greater share of the population than any one faith group or denomination.
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  #54  
Old 7th September 2017, 08:33 AM
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Default Re: Christianity is dying.

when it rains it pours

‘Christian America’ dwindling, including white evangelicals, study shows



http://religionnews.com/2017/09/06/e...s-study-shows/


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The future of religion in America is young, non-Christian and technicolor.
Almost every Christian denomination in the U.S. shows signs of growing diversity as white Christians, once the majority in most mainline Protestant and Catholic denominations, give way to younger members, who tend to be of different races, according to a study released Wednesday (Sept. 6) by the Public Religion Research Institute.
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  #55  
Old 13th September 2017, 09:18 AM
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Default Re: Christianity is dying.

White Christians are now a minority — but they’re getting more isolated and less tolerant

http://www.salon.com/2017/09/11/whit...less-tolerant/


Quote:
Last week, the Public Religion Research Institute (PRRI) put out a new report on religion in America that measured a truly remarkable shift: For the first time, almost certainly in the country’s history, people who identify as white Christians are a minority of Americans. Four out of every five Americans were self-described white Christians in 1976, but now that group only constitutes 43 percent of the U.S. population.
There are a lot of reasons for this shift, study author Robert P. Jones, who heads PRRI and is the author of “The End of White Christian America,” explained to Salon in an interview. To a large extent, Jones said, it’s the trend of “young, white people leaving Christian churches that is driving up the number of religiously unaffiliated Americans.”
This reflects, he added, “a culture clash between particularly conservative white churches and denominations and younger Americans” over issues like science, particularly climate change and evolution, and especially the rights of LGBT people.
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  #56  
Old 13th September 2017, 07:24 PM
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Default Re: Christianity is dying.

Meanwhile, in the UK:

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Britain is fast becoming one of the least religious countries in the world. Although vestiges of the religious establishments that formerly set the pace of British public life still manage to exert power, more and more British people are leaving the faith of their parents behind.

A recent study by the National Centre for Social Research found that more than half of the adult population does not have a religion, but more encouragingly 71 percent of 18-25-year olds report the same thing. Today’s figures show a marked difference from the first survey in 1983, when only 31 percent of the public was a-religious.

This becomes even more striking when the percentage of those who consider themselves religious are compared with those that frequent their various places of worship: of the 17 percent that are identified as members of the Church of England, only 1.4 percent of these people care enough to actually attend church. Whilst some attribute this shift more to a change in societal attitudes than to a dramatic drop in the number of sincere religious believers, one thing is absolutely clear: religion is losing its appeal and church leaders are noticing.
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