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  #21  
Old 12th September 2017, 01:02 PM
wadaye wadaye is offline
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Default Re: When Climate Change Denial Is All One Can Do.

We know Trump is not only limited in words, but also in letters. Sad.

Sadly the system is built around property rather than the relatively novel and new discourse of human rights. Environmental rights are not even in sight.
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  #22  
Old 13th September 2017, 08:59 AM
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stylofone stylofone is online now
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Default Re: When Climate Change Denial Is All One Can Do.

i just heard American Professor Jeffrey Sachs on the radio, talking about the possible criminal liability of politicians who deny climate science and corruptly do the bidding of big energy companies. This article he wrote spells it out, with Texas as an example. To the constant drumbeat of climate denial, politicians beholden to big oil have failed to act on the growing flood risk.

As I was reading the article, the compulsory CNN video popped up on the web page. It was the Texas governor Greg Abbott, in his law-enforcement style shirt with its Lone Star logo, talking about the emergency recovery... appropriate behaviour during the hurricane crisis, but it was also a bit of ironic governmental theatre given the content of the article next to it outlining Abbott's role in the leadup to the storm.

Quote:
In other words, Texas is the moral hazard state.


Here is what has not happened: There has been little or no effort at zoning protection to keep development clear of floodplains; little or no offshore and onshore infrastructure for flood protection; no discernible heed paid to the scientific evidence and indeed the growing practical experience of catastrophic flood risks; and of course, relentless, pervasive climate change denial, the mother's milk of Texas politics.


So, here's the deal. Those of us elsewhere in the US also suffering from flooding and other disasters from warming temperatures, rising sea levels, and more intense storms (such as New Yorkers who are still rebuilding from 2012 Hurricane Sandy) want truth from Texas politicians and the oil industry.


We are bearing the costs of your lies. We are tired of it. More importantly, we are in pain and solidarity with the good people of Houston who are losing lives, homes, and livelihoods because of your lies.
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  #23  
Old 13th September 2017, 09:50 AM
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The Irreverent Mr Black The Irreverent Mr Black is offline
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Default Re: When Climate Change Denial Is All One Can Do.

And, topical for this thread because it involves heads up arses where environmental matters are concerned:
Quote:
The Federal Government is weighing up a redesign of the proposed Clean Energy Target (CET) to accommodate investment in 'clean coal'. That could help the Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull win support of the divided Coalition party room.


Australia has agreed to cut greenhouse emissions by 26-28 per cent by 2030. The chief scientist Alan Finkel has called for a Clean Energy Target to help meet that. But it is politically difficult for Mr Turnbull. There are already rumblings against it within the Coalition, including from former PM Tony Abbott.


The ABC understands the re-shaped CET would come under a new name, with a revised target below that recommended by Dr Finkel. It would allow for high efficiency, low emissions coal-fired power stations to access subsidies.
...
The former chief executive of the Clean Energy Finance Corporation, Oliver Yates, says this is the latest example of a "polarisation" of the energy debate in Australia:
Quote:
That’s what you’re seeing at the moment, the concept of changing the clean energy target to something like a dirty energy target, the almost inverse of it. That’s the type of polarisation we have in the debate.
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  #24  
Old 15th September 2017, 01:15 AM
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Default Re: When Climate Change Denial Is All One Can Do.

In the Guardian Thursday,

John Hewson, former leader of the Liberal Party, now professor at ANU,

The current energy debate is farcical. What does this government stand for?

Quote:
This “gap” would be easily filled by a combination of base-load solar thermal projects, batteries and some better demand management well before 2022. Having set the regulatory direction of the “market” with a CET, the government should stand back and let the technologies compete to deliver the most cost-effective and sustainable outcome.
It is also worth recognising that a new coal-fired power plant, if it could be built, may simply accelerate the closures of other older, less efficient, plants, so not actually closing the perceived “gap”.
https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ment-stand-for

Now Tony Abbott ever grasping, not even wrong, on his usual 2GB Thursday deliverance,

By Katherine Murphy,

Abbott calls for end to all energy subsidies, including on coal

Quote:
And while acknowledging that he signed Australia up to the Paris climate agreement while prime minister, Abbott now argues we are not obliged to abide by the commitments made in the international accord.

Abbott said there was no need to walk away from the Paris agreement, because the emissions reductions commitments contained within it were not binding on Australia.


https://www.theguardian.com/australi...luding-on-coal
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  #25  
Old 15th September 2017, 11:21 PM
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Default Re: When Climate Change Denial Is All One Can Do.

Reading this short article I was filled with indignation, rancour and dudgeon, about Charles Koch and the exclusive Mont Pelerin Society, of which John Howard is also a member. Maurice Newman, Bob Day. Is Tony Abbott a member too? Why wouldn't he be?

To claim that climate scientists and cancer research scientists fabricate falsehood and obfuscation out of purely pecuniary interest says nothing about such a claim and everything about the claimants, their total amorality. Their sacred neo-liberal ideology is toxic. They themselves are maleficent, dangerous, criminal. And they know it.

We members and contributors to the AFA Forums do it because it is hugely rewarding but one also hopes to do some good, I'm sure. It looks it to me. Something has to be done.

The Guardian
Sept 15
Graham Readfearn

Climate change scepticism
Planet Oz

The idea that climate scientists are in it for the cash has deep ideological roots

Quote:
Author and academic Nancy MacLean says cynicism about the motives of public servants, including government-backed climate scientists, can be traced to a group of neoliberals and their ‘toxic’ ideas
https://www.theguardian.com/environm...ological-roots
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  #26  
Old 15th September 2017, 11:53 PM
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stylofone stylofone is online now
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Default Re: When Climate Change Denial Is All One Can Do.

The ridiculous thing about this concept is that there's so much more money in climate denial, surely if the scientists wanted cash they would all be working for big oil. The idea that there's no such thing as altruism has been toxic for decades now. Clinton and Blair went for it. Obama tried to turn it around, he explicitly spoke about people being motivated by public service. It was one of his themes but it didn't get traction.

Quote:
Strato said View Post
Reading this short article I was filled with indignation, rancour and dudgeon, about Charles Koch and the exclusive Mont Pelerin Society, of which John Howard is also a member. Maurice Newman, Bob Day. Is Tony Abbott a member too? Why wouldn't he be?

To claim that climate scientists and cancer research scientists fabricate falsehood and obfuscation out of purely pecuniary interest says nothing about such a claim and everything about the claimants, their total amorality. Their sacred neo-liberal ideology is toxic. They themselves are maleficent, dangerous, criminal. And they know it.

We members and contributors to the AFA Forums do it because it is hugely rewarding but one also hopes to do some good, I'm sure. It looks it to me. Something has to be done.

The Guardian
Sept 15
Graham Readfearn

Climate change scepticism
Planet Oz

The idea that climate scientists are in it for the cash has deep ideological roots



https://www.theguardian.com/environm...ological-roots
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  #27  
Old 17th September 2017, 10:50 AM
stevebrooks stevebrooks is online now
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Default Re: When Climate Change Denial Is All One Can Do.

Quote:
Strato said View Post
To claim that climate scientists and cancer research scientists fabricate falsehood and obfuscation out of purely pecuniary interest says nothing about such a claim and everything about the claimants, their total amorality. Their sacred neo-liberal ideology is toxic. They themselves are maleficent, dangerous, criminal. And they know it.
To imply that every climate scientist and every cancer research scientists is in it for the pecuniary benefit is tantamount to slander and/or libel, that there are millions of researchers out there with so little ethical and moral grounding that they are willing to accept money for lies. I haven't heard such vitriol and false accusation against a group since, well, atheists appeared in public
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